Bound for home: Chicago's William Petersen looks beyond 'CSI' to a return to the stage

Home, for the Evanston-born actor, is the Chicago stage. And he’s in talks with Victory Gardens Theater, which gave him his first starring role, about appearing in one of the company’s 2007 productions. (Petersen also says he’d like to work at Chicago Shakespeare Theater or the Goodman Theatre.)

“I’ve been talking to [artistic director] Dennis Zacek at Victory Gardens, and we’re going to do a play as soon as we can get enough time to make it worth everyone’s while,” Petersen says. “I plan to go back to Chicago and do plays starting next year.”

Zacek says he’d love to get the actor into one of his 2006-07 productions, which will be staged at the company’s new home at the Biograph Theater on Lincoln Avenue. But if the work Zacek has in mind doesn’t pan out, he and Petersen may end up teaming up in the 2007-08 season.

“I’m trying to have something custom-made for him, but it’s in the making. It’s not finished,” says Zacek, who adds that he hopes to have the script ready for Petersen to read when the actor arrives in town for Victory Gardens’ season-opening gala Oct. 14.

“I’m not sure this means we won’t see him in any more movies or in any more TV stuff, but I do think there’s a hunger to get back to the demands and the purity and the risks of live theater,” Zacek adds.

CBS Entertainment president Nina Tassler says she doesn’t want to think about, let alone discuss, what “CSI” will do in its eighth season or beyond if Petersen leaves or reduces his presence on the show.

Cooking up the key elements of the show’s seventh season -which will have a recurring serial-killer theme, a new forensic psychologist who will “throw Grissom off his game,” and the slowly developing relationship between Grissom and Sidle - kept “CSI” producers busy enough, she notes.

“I’m so excited about this season - who knows what next year’s going to bring? I really have no idea,” she says.

“CSI” without Grissom? “I can’t even imagine that,” Tassler says.

Petersen and his wife, Gina, bought a condo in downtown Chicago a year ago, and though the actor doesn’t rule out a return to “CSI” in some capacity next year, it doesn’t sound as though he wants to be on the show’s L.A. soundstage all season.

In fact, to take some of the heat off his planned return to the Chicago stage, Petersen’s taking a few weeks off this season to do “Dublin Carol” at Trinity Rep in Rhode Island. To do that show, he’ll miss two “CSI” episodes.

“There may be stuff I do [on `CSI’] next year. I just know that I want to do a play in Chicago next year,” says Petersen, who hasn’t acted here since he had a starring role the 1998 production of “Flyovers” at Victory Gardens. “CSI’s” producers will have to “make accommodations” that allow him to return to the theater, he says. “Because at some point, that’s what I am,” he says. “This is not what I am.”

“This” has been six years of long days as a very famous television actor, in a show that became more successful than anyone involved in it ever dreamed.

As executive producer Carol Mendelsohn has said, CBS executives were reluctant to give out the show’s very first ratings report - the numbers were so high, the execs thought Nielsen Media Research must have gotten them wrong.

“CSI” has matured into a behemoth that has drawn an average of 25 million to 26 million viewers in the last four TV seasons. It was the No. 1 show from 2002 to 2005 (it was knocked off its perch by “American Idol” in the 2005-06 season), and it spawned not only a host of lesser imitators but the spinoffs “CSI: Miami” and “CSI: NY.”

Petersen says many TV shows were offered to him over the years (CBS Corp. CEO “Leslie [Moonves] had been asking him for 10 years,” Tassler notes), but the actor “didn’t want to get locked down,” he says. “CSI” finally snagged him, he says, thanks to the complexity of the role of Grissom, a shy, slyly funny entomologist turned dogged crime-scene investigator.

“This was somebody that I was not like, and I was going to be able to learn something,” Petersen says. “Because I thought, what if it goes seven years? Everybody thinks it’ll go seven days, but what if it goes seven years? You better have something that keeps you interested.”

Still, despite six years leading the ensemble on television’s top-rated scripted show - plus a substantial career in films before “CSI” - Petersen says he still considers himself a theater guy first and foremost.

“If you learned to play baseball first, that’s your sport,” said Petersen, a die-hard Cubs fan. “That doesn’t mean you can’t play basketball and football, but you’re always going to want to return to baseball.”

“I’ve been fortunate enough to grow up playing baseball and learn to play basketball and football well enough, and be successful at it. Now it’s time to go back to baseball. I feel like Michael Jordan [when he said], `You know, I could have played baseball too. So I think I’m going to leave the Bulls and go play baseball.’”

And Petersen’s return to Victory Gardens is life coming full circle, in more ways than one. Twenty-eight years ago, the actor created a sensation when he starred in William J. Norris’ play “Dillinger” at Victory Gardens. In real life, of course, Dillinger was killed near the Biograph Theatre - which, in one of those stranger-than-fiction twists, is Victory Gardens’ new home.

Zacek, who directed Petersen in that play, still remembers the decision to cast the 25 year old actor; at first, he and Norris thought Petersen was much to young for the role.

“The more we read, the more we liked him,” Zacek says. And Petersen adapted to make himself look older: “He had to shave the side of his head to give himself a receding hairline,” the director recalls.

Petersen went on to co-found Chicago’s Remains Theatre and become a mainstay of what was emerging as the world-famous off-Loop theater scene.

His portrayal of “In the Belly of the Beast” killer Jack Henry Abbott at Wisdom Bridge Theatre “crosses the usual boundaries of `acting’ into an area of experience I found staggering,” the Tribune’s former theater critic Richard Christiansen wrote in 1983.

As Christiansen recalled in his 2002 book, “A Theater of Our Own: A History and Memoir of 1,001 Nights in Chicago,” “Driving back to the office to file my review after [`Beast’s] opening night, I had to pull over to the side of the road and rest there for a few minutes in order to collect myself.”

“As a teacher, you’re not ever able to make anyone into an actor. God gives the talent,” says Zacek, who first met Petersen three decades ago at an Evanston Burger King, where the director was nursing a coffee.

Petersen somehow knew that Zacek was connected to the theater world, and he introduced himself. “He said, `My name is Billy Petersen and I wondered if I could sit down and talk to you. I’m thinking of being an actor and just wondered what kind of advice you could give me,’” Zacek recalls.

A couple days later, Zacek stopped in for another coffee. Petersen was there again. They talked again, and eventually Petersen began taking classes at Victory Gardens Training Center. And he stood out from the start, Zacek says.

“Billy is someone who respects the intelligence of the audience, and that’s I think a big key to the success that he’s experienced,” Zacek says.

“He’s an incredibly charismatic guy, and he’s also someone who’s not afraid of taking risks,” Zacek says. “He has taken many a risk in many a show. He’s extremely courageous as an actor, and also someone who is very kinetic and physical in his work, as well as verbal. He’s got a lot going for him.”

And Petersen is nothing if not loyal. When Victory Gardens acquired the Biograph Theater for its new home, a decision had to be made as to whether money would be spent on digging out space under the stage for “traps,” or openings in the stage floor that can be used for various theatrical effects.

The lack of traps at Victory Gardens’ old space had limited the kinds of plays the company could do, artistic director Dennis Zacek says, but there was resistance within the theater’s organization from those who thought the traps would be too expensive or could lead to flooding.

Petersen heard about the situation, and ended up putting up most of the money for the construction of the traps. It was a sizable six-figure sum, Zacek says.

“It was artist to artist,” Zacek says of the gift. “It allows us to have a flexibility we’ve never had before.” And it was, he jokes, “major payback for time spent over coffee.”

Before Petersen gets back to Chicago for the Victory Gardens gala, there’s the little matter of launching the seventh season of “CSI.” This year, life gets more difficult for Grissom, the actor says. Years of coming upon corpses in bizarre and tragic situations have taken their toll.

“Now he’s having to supervise every death encounter that happens in Las Vegas. And it’s daunting,” says Petersen, who became a grandfather almost three years ago. “As anyone’s job is as they grow older and as they become more proficient, it becomes more daunting. It’s more daunting for me to do the seventh season of `CSI’ than it was to do the first, oddly enough.”

Grissom’s journey and his own have parallels, he says. Like Grissom, who now supervises and mentors the Las Vegas CSI staff, Petersen feels a deep responsibility to both the show’s fans and to the 200 people who work on “CSI.”

When Grissom comes across a body, Petersen explains, the investigator “can say to himself, `I didn’t have anything to do with this, but I want to make sure that somebody explains it.’ That’s the heroic part, and that’s the part that can keep him doing it.

“And it’s kind of the same way for me as an actor in the show. You know, yeah, a lot of the doing of it is tedious and routine and it’s not the new play from Ireland or England, but I want to make sure that the audience is OK. I want to make sure that they get some kind of closure.”

But will there be closure -or at least more details - for fans who want to know more about the Grissom-Sidle romance? It sounds as though the show is going to take its time on that front (more on that here).

“I think they’ve been very careful, because it’s obviously a very dicey situation at work if this was a relationship that was uncovered,” Petersen says. “And yet, they found themselves together on some levels. We don’t know what levels for sure, you know?”

“But they obviously always have been interested in each other. And there’s an intimacy there. We just thought it was time for the audience to see that there is an intimacy there.”

Some fans theorize the couple have been together since Sidle arrived in the second episode of the series (the characters had known each other before either arrived in Vegas). And though Petersen and Jorja Fox, who plays Sidle, have ideas about when the romance began, they’re not sharing their theories.

“If you want a lot of the audience to come with you and be part of the journey, then you have to trust the creators to take you there,” Petersen notes. “And if I say, `This is what happened and this is where it’s been and this is where it’s going,’ then [viewers might] watch `Grey’s Anatomy’!”

In any case, Naren Shankar, one of the show’s executive producers, told the Tribune in July that Grissom and Sidle’s pairing is part of an complicated emotional journey for the CSI supervisor (more on that here).

“What do you do when something you’ve kept at bay for the longest time, which is really the sadness and the misery of a certain part of this job, actually gets through your defenses?” Shankar said.

“Part of what we we’re doing with Grissom and Sara being together is, here’s a guy who for the first time in maybe his life is reaching out to another human being,” he noted.

Still, especially given the Thursday matchup with last season’s No. 5 show, the romance has given “CSI” an unusual amount of buzz for a show going into its seventh season.

“I don’t know that I’m surprised,” says Tassler, when asked about the pre-season “CSI” chatter. “I’m relieved,” she says, unleashing a full-throated chuckle.

And despite their public lack of concern over getting “dinged” by “Grey’s Anatomy” when the two dramas go up against each other on Thursdays this fall, CBS executives must be at least a little nervous about whether the cornerstone of their crime-procedural empire will take a serious hit from ABC’s red-hot doctor drama.

Petersen, for his part, says he doesn’t think about the threat from ABC’s sexy doctors. But he is worried about competition from one man. One bald man. On NBC.

“I think Grissom watches `Deal or No Deal,’” Petersen said. “I’m a lot more worried about that show than `Grey’s Anatomy.’.”

Below is a transcript of my conversation with Petersen.

So what are you plans for next year?

“I haven’t been able to do a play since this thing started. I’m going to do a play oddly enough in Rhode Island, because it’s at Christmas and it’s a little five-week deal and I can do it. But I haven’t been able to do a play in Chicago since we started the TV show. That’s my goal.

“I’ve been talking to Dennis Zajek at Victory Gardens and we’re going to do a play as soon as we can get enough time to make it worth everyone’s while. I plan to go back to Chicago and do plays starting next year.”

Is this your last year on “CSI”?

“There may be stuff I do next year, I just know that I want to do a play in Chicago next year. I know they [are] going to make accommodations for that. Because at some point, that’s what I am, this is not what I am.”

Is it that the show has gone much longer than you expected?

“No, no, it’s just that if you learned to play baseball first, that’s your sport. That doesn’t mean you can’t play basketball and football, but you’re always going to want to return to baseball.

“I’ve been fortunate enough to grow up playing baseball and learn to play basketball and football well enough, and be successful at it. Now it’s time to go back to baseball. I feel like Michael Jordan [when he said,] ‘You know, I could have played baseball too. So I think I’m going to leave the Bulls and go play baseball.’ Even if it’s Triple A. He didn’t care.”

So next year you see yourself as not being in every episode?

“Yes. I do [see it that way]. I like to think I’d get some time to do a play in Chicago. I’m going to get some time this year to do a play at Trinity Rep in Rhode Island.

"And I’m doing that kind of because it takes a little bit of the heat off of going back to [do a play in] Chicago. Because that’s kind of a zoo back there. This was also just a perfect little Christmas play, and I could do it without missing a lot of work. But if I come back to Chicago I want to do a run of a show, so people can come and see it.”

What’s the play in Rhode Island?

“It’s called ‘Dublin Carol,’ it takes place in Ireland on Christmas Eve.”

You could run that forever in Chicago.

“Except it’s a Christmas play [laughs].”

Yeah, but any play about the Irish runs seems to run forever.

“Well, if we do well in Rhode Island, I’d like to think that maybe we could do in Chicago at Christmas next year. It’s a beautiful play and it’s a beautiful character and I’d like to think I’m going to do it well, and if that’s the case, I’d like to consider the opportunity to do it in Chicago at Christmas in 2007 or 2008.”

What kind of play are you looking for, when you return here next year?

“I’m trying to work out something with Dennis Zajek at the Victory Gardens, which is where I first got my Equity card 26 years ago. So we’re trying to find a play that works for him and for me and for the theater. We’re looking at something next summer. It’s hard, because he does new plays, often by new playwrights. So we’re trying to find something that makes sense for all of us.

"We will find something, you know, whether it’s this summer or the following year or whatever. But that’s who I’m working with, the Victory Gardens on Lincoln Avenue. And I’d like to work with Barbara Gaines at [Chicago] Shakespeare [Theater] and Bob Falls again at the Goodman [Theatre]. It’s where I grew up.”

I wanted to talk to you about the finale from last season, there was such a hue and cry over it…

“Yeah? ’Cause Brass got shot?”   

Yeah, of course. It was all about Brass.

“Well, that’s how I felt, anyway. It was all about Brass.”

Indeed, for a lot of fans that was a big deal. But as far as your character and that of Jorja Fox hooking up, fan reaction sort of went off the chart, especially online. Were you aware of all that?

“I pretty much stay unaware. I gave my computer away 6 years ago. I don’t go on the [sites], I just don’t do any of that stuff. I don’t go on the internet. I don’t watch the shows, really, any more.

“The fact of the matter is, is that I believe that we [Grissom and Sara Sidle] have had a relationship since I met her before the series started. The characters, Grissom and Sara met [before the start  of the show]. After the pilot, we bring in Jorja to investigate what happened to the gal that got killed in the pilot.

“Obviously there was some sort of mentor-protégé relationship that was developed at the very beginning, that Grissom was tenuous about and has been and whatnot. I don’t know exactly when this thing started.

“All the scene was last year was, the audience gets to look through the keyhole for a minute, and go, ‘Oh, [these characters] go home.’ I never thought this was a show that should go home with the characters much. Because [co-workers] don’t at work, much. You know, you go to work at the paper, everybody’s got their lives and there’s a lot of stuff that goes on at the paper, but that doesn’t mean you bring it all home and everybody knows what everyone did last weekend. That’s like life.

“I think they’ve been very careful, because it’s obviously a very dicey situation at work if this was a relationship that was uncovered. And yet, they found themselves together on some levels. We don’t know what levels for sure, you know?

“But they obviously always have been interested in each other. And there’s an intimacy there. We just thought it was time for the audience to see that there is an intimacy there. We don’t know what it is, I don’t think. I mean, I don’t think anyone knows exactly what’s going on.”

So you don’t have a fixed idea in your mind of how long they’ve been together?

“Oh, I do, but I don’t know that the people who are perceiving it do [know], you know? Sara and Grissom know. You know what I mean? And they’ve been very careful to avoid anyone else knowing.”

Do you think they’ve been together since she got to Vegas, or do you not want to say when you think this happened?

“Well, does it matter, really?’

Honestly, I would have said, for me personally, no, it doesn’t matter, but for readers and fans and people who’ve emailed me, they’ve really wanted to know.

“But if you invite all your friends to a barbecue and this couple shows up together, don’t you go, ‘Hey, are they together? We know they’re friends? What exactly is it?’ Jorja and I have our ideas about it as actors, but again, the show needs to spool this out. If we’d gotten into this relationship in the second or third year of the show, we’d be done now.

“If you want a lot of the audience to come with you and be part of the journey, then you  have to trust the creators to take you there. And if I say, this is what happened and this is where it’s been and this is where it’s going, then, [the audience might] watch ‘Grey’s Anatomy’!

“I’ll give you an example – TV Guide desperately wanted to do a cover of me and Jorja, for the premiere week. I was a little against it, but then we decided we’d do it, but we wouldn’t do it as if there was some sort of other thing beyond what we do [for a living].

“Our show’s about puzzles, about solving puzzles. And this is one of those puzzles that’s in the show. We get to solve it. Hopefully, like the show, we will solve the puzzle. That doesn’t mean we’re going to solve it today.”

But the two characters seem to have chemistry, as well as an intellectual friendship.

“Yeah, absolutely. When I was younger, when I was 20, I read a book by Herman Hesse called ‘Narcissus and Goldmund.’ It’s a fabulous study of a mentor protégé relationship. As we grow older, there’s a part of us that wants to stay young, and there’s a part of us that is very intrigued with passing that on and getting that back. It’s the classic mentor-protégé relationship where the protégé can surpass the mentor, and then what do you do?

“And I think that’s what’s interesting to me, and always has been, which is why I never wanted the relationship to go away. I wanted the, I think Jorja and I both wanted this thing, we know we have chemistry and we know we can play off it and we enjoy it. It’s just like in any relationship, if you run into somebody where that feels right for, you don’t want to give it up, so you do things to protect it.

“Yet you know you’re on a fine line. It’s a fine line between, how do I keep this enticing and not ruin it? And I think that’s where Grissom and Sara are, that fine line that you walk at some point, you know, how do you progress it, what do we do? They have a huge challenge, which Grissom sometimes tried to bail out of and Sara tried to bail out of. There were different moments over the years where it was like, yeeesh.

“And nobody in CSI knows. But do they hear something, do the see something, do they suspect something? Maybe. As the audience did. The difference is, the only thing that’s happened is that the audience happened to see them at home. And so now they’re going to have to deal with what they saw. And we have to deal with making sure they don’t see too much, too. Because otherwise we’re a different show.”

That’s what some fans seem to be concerned about. I like when shows bring in the characters’ personal lives, but depending on what kind of show it is, it can be a tricky balancing act.

“Absolutely. And I don’t think our show works on that level. But you cannot deny the chemistry. The one thing that separates ‘CSI,’ I feel, and this personal, this is Billy Petersen talking, is that there is chemistry throughout the whole cast. And the show was created around that chemistry. So you’re not going to deny the chemistry. And that leads to stuff.

“But when we go too far [afield] in terms of personal lives, [the reaction may be] who cares? When you go to work, you don’t want to hear too much about somebody’s life, because what am I supposed to do with that? What am I supposed to with all your personal baggage. [It’s like], ‘I got a lot to do today, I don’t need to do this.’

“I think that we didn’t show too much at the end of last season. And what did we show? Did we show anything? No. We know that they’re intimate. But they may be intimate in the way that a married couple is intimate. That they’ve already done all that other stuff and now they just hang out and talk about what they did today.”

And he really needs that, because as you’ve said and the producers have said, Grissom wants everyone to think his head is bigger than his heart, but that’s not really the case. Everything does affect him on some level.

“Yes, absolutely. He wouldn’t be as good at what he does if he didn’t have that. And now he’s trying to figure out where to place it. And it’s very confusing for a person who’s spent their life… and this is true of anybody.

“It’s true of an actor. You can live your life doing something and knowing this is how you have to do it, and this is how you have to be to do it. And then you find yourself at a certain age, going, God, all the effort I have to put in to try to be this person. And at the same time, my heart’s breaking.

“He doesn’t know. Who does? We can say that Grissom doesn’t know [about life] because he’s weird, or because he’s an entomologist and he’s weird. But it’s not that, he’s just a regular person who still doesn’t know. You can be in any marriage or relationship this or that… you don’t know. He’s just trying to figure it out.

“At the end of the day, the job they do is what they do, is who they are. [He] doesn’t say, ‘I’m Sara Sidle’s boyfriend,’ [he] says ‘I’m the supervisor of the CSI graveyard shift.’ What else do you do? ‘I ride rollercoasters.’ What else? ‘I have a bug collection.’ What else? ‘Sometimes I go to this friend’s house late at night and talk to her.’”

[Executive producer] Naren [Shankar] said something interesting, that after a while, for a thinking feeling compassionate person, what you do and see in this job has got to sink in and affect you. Does Grissom face that this season?

“I think so. I think there are certain things that are in place this year, it’s also a buildup of time. Doesn’t everybody in every job… I mean, don’t I say, I could be in regional theater having a lovely time, spending the day wandering around town then going at night for two hours and doing a play, without a whole lot of terrible baggage or going into the grocery story and being recognized by everybody? … At some point [a writer might] go, when am I going to get to that book, or [an actor might say] when am I going to do ‘Lear’? 

“In Grissom’s case, it’s like, ‘Have I gone to far away from why I got into this to begin with? Why I got into it is the study of insects. I loved that little piece of life, where I could put a ranch inside a glass case and watch it grow. And now all I do is autopsies. And find people in horrible, misshapen conditions.’ At some point, you go, ‘The whole reason I loved this when I was a kid was because I loved to follow the ants to see where they went all day long.’

“And now he’s having to supervise every death encounter that happens in Las Vegas. And it’s daunting. As anyone’s job is as they grow older and as they become more proficient it becomes more daunting. It’s more daunting for me to do the seventh season of ‘CSI’ than it was to do the first, oddly enough.”

Why?

“I mean, the first was harder on some level, physically, but the seventh, there’s more responsibility to it. You have a much bigger audience that you have to deal with and you have to feel some responsibility to it. I mean, that’s the deal. For all of us. That’s all I’m trying to do anyway, is just say, this guy has a specific talent that’s different from a lot of people’s, But he’s the same person. He’s somebody’s who’s just trying desperately not found out. [He’s just saying,] God, can I keep this up?

“I think that [desire to find the creative spark that started it all] is true of anybody in any sort of creative environment, whether it’s writing or acting or music or crime solving. The interesting thing about Grissom is that he believes he’s being creative when he gets the call. … At some point, it becomes, are you interested in getting that call, or do you hope it goes to somebody else?”

It’s just got to be tiring.

“Yeah, it’s tiring. Everybody’s job is tiring at some point. And believe me, I’m a lot different at 53 than I was at 40. At 40, I wouldn’t have done a TV series.”

Why not?

“They kept sending them to me, but I wasn’t interested. I didn’t want to get locked down. But this is what we do in the world, is we get locked down. We do what we do, and we do what we’re good at.

“And then you go, ‘Oh man. This is a little snakier than I wanted it to be, you know?’ I didn’t want to know everything about this person, everything about that. I didn’t want the responsibility of everybody else’s children. That’s a huge thing. When you have the responsibility. I don’t know how corporate executives do it, when they fire a whole division.

“The thing that keeps me at it is, we’re doing a series and there’s 200 people working on the show and they all have kids. We can’t let the show collapse, what are these guys gonna do? How are those kids gonna go to high school?”

And how you face up to that kind of real responsibility in life, that’s the measure of who you are.

“That’s the heroic aspect in life that’s interesting to me. And that’s what’s interesting to me in terms of ‘CSI’ or anything else in life. It’s like, how do you handle [something], when it becomes really a pain in the ass, what are you going to sacrifice to do this because it’s good for somebody else?

“And I’m attuned to not only the people who work on the show but the people who watch the show, and I want to make sure that it’s okay for them. I can’t control everything, and for me personally, like Grissom, I might have left two years ago, or four years ago, or I might not have ever done it.

“But at some point, you say, you know what, this is a huge responsibility. I’m going to do this. And that’s what makes these characters in ‘CSI’ heroic – not that they are carrying guns and shooting guys and saving lives. They’re not saving lives. They’re defining lives.

“And at some point it’s heroic, because they keep going there. And at some point, you will see the struggle of what it takes to go there.

“The part that is healing for Grissom is when he’s in the autopsy room with Robbins. There’s a certain part where you go, OK, this person’s not here any more. We can talk about him, we can operate on him. It’s very obvious to me that [at a certain point] the person is gone.

“I always thought the show would work, because at the beginning of the show, the person is gone. It’s not like where you get to know the person through the course of the show and then you kill the person. That would be horrible. I don’t want to do that show. But this show, the person is gone to begin with and then we try and fill in that person’s life. That’s the saving grace.

“That’s the one thing that they can do, that Grissom can say to himself, I didn’t have anything to do with this, but I want to make sure that somebody explains it. That’s the heroic part, and that’s the part that can keep him doing it.

“And its kind of the same way for me as an actor in the show. You know, yeah, a lot of the doing of it is tedious and routine and it’s not the new play from Ireland or England, but I want to make sure that the audience is OK. I want to make sure that they get some kind of closure.

What part of playing Grissom do you enjoy playing the most?

“The mere fact that he knows something about science, which I know nothing about. I’ve learned a lot from Grissom. That was the point of doing this as opposed to doing a cop or a lawyer or a ex-husband who’s got kids. There were a million different things that they came to [me] for.

“This was somebody that I was not like, and I was going to be able to learn something. Because I thought, what if it goes seven years? Everybody thinks it’ll go seven days, but what if it goes seven years? You better have something that keeps you interested. And this was something different from me. He’s an interesting guy.

“He becomes a huge test for Sara Sidle. You talk about trying to have a relationship with a man – Sara has her work cut out for her. This is a complex man that she’s trying to figure out how to deal with, so of course it takes all kinds of fits and starts. Don’t you think?”

But she seems very persistent. She doesn’t give up.

“And that’s what he loves about her. She’s a bulldog. And he always saw that in her. And he always knew that subconsciously the only person the only person who’d be able to give him a second look is someone who’s not willing to take the first look for granted.”

But he’s guarded that way. He doesn’t want to just put himself out there.

“Totally. And she and he, like everybody else, has all kinds of deeper dimensions and deeper secrets and problems and crises and tragedies that infuse their lives. And I don’t know that we ever know. My parents were married for 74 years before they passed away. And I don’t know how much you know after all of that, you know?

“The interesting thing about them is that they’re willing to protect it. Even though they don’t know what they have, or whether they have anything. Even in their doubts and their fears, they are still protective of each other. Which is why nobody knows about it. Which is why there was just a peek through the keyhole at the end of last season.”

Is part of why the protect it because it’s a very tender thing and they both don’t have much intimacy in their lives?

“Absolutely, they could bleed to death. They could bleed to death. They’re like hemophiliacs, truly. They don’t have relationships, they don’t know anything about it. And that’s interesting to me, that’s the Garden of Eden. It’s Adam and Eve.

“If somebody comes along and despoils this garden, it’s all going to get really rough for everybody else. Which is what happened in the garden of Eden [laughs]. If that damn snake didn’t show up, we could be having a nice cocktail in a hammock on a Hawaiian shore. But the serpent showed up and screwed the whole deal up and now we’re all struggling.”

So I have to ask, what’s your thought on the competition with “Grey’s Anatomy”?

“You know, I don’t know much about that. I don’t have much of a chance to watch any television, except for sports. I only watch the Cubs or the Bears. I don’t program CBS or ABC, so I don’t know much. I had a friend that was a costume designer on the show the first year, so I know what she thinks about the show.

“I wish them well. I’m sure it’s a good show, or it wouldn’t have all this notoriety or whatever. But I really don’t know anything about it. I’m trying to be honest, it really doesn’t have anything to do with me, in my day. I can’t go, ‘OK, what are we going to do this week because we’re up against “Grey’s Anatomy”’?”

“No, we do our show and they do their show – you know, they’re not suddenly going to do some ‘CSI’ stuff.

“I know that we started out Friday nights and CBS moves us to Thursday to go after ‘ER’ and ‘Will and Grace’ and all that stuff, with ‘Survivor.’ That was six years ago. We were going, ‘Why do we have to do this? Why do we have to go up against them? We were doing fine on Friday nights.’ They did that because they want to beat the other guy.

“So ABC is going, and oddly enough it’s [ABC head] Steve McPherson who was at Disney and an executive on our show when we created it, he’s saying, ‘We’re going to get those guys.’

“I mean, what kind of shelf life is anybody going to have in this deal? I don’t feel our audience is going to leave us for ‘Grey’s Anatomy,’ and I don’t think ‘Grey’s Anatomy’s’ audience is going to not follow them to Thursday nights. It’s what Thursday nights are, these people [at the networks] like to compete.

“Really, at the end of the day, we [on the shows] don’t compete. I’m not going to compete with Patrick Dempsey. He doesn’t want that and I don’t want that. … All we do is try to figure out how to shoot the day. I hope that there’s room for, and I think there is, both of us at 9 o’clock.

“My biggest concern, quite frankly, is Howie Mandel. Quite frankly, it’s my favorite show on TV. I have two shows I like on TV, ‘Rock Star: Supernova,’ with Tommy Lee and Dilana, and Howie Mandel.”

Are you kidding about Howie Mandel?

“Oh no. [A journalist] asked me, ‘If Grissom could end up on one other TV show in America, what show would he want to be on?’ And I said, ‘Grissom would like to go toe-to-toe with Howie Mandel, “Deal or No Deal.”’ He’s got like 30 babes, with briefcases very similar to Grissom’s.

“At the end of the day, Grissom’s like, ‘Wait a minute, that guy’s bald, and he has 30 girls, and they all have his briefcase? How come he got that show? I could do that show! I could wear the tux, shave my head.’ I think Grissom watches ‘Deal or No Deal.’ I’m a lot more worried about that show than ‘Grey’s Anatomy.’”

Well, maybe there’s room for all three of you.

"Yeah well, we’ll hope. Nonetheless, I’ll be watching Howie."